Lo picken,
Glad to hear that I'm not the only one dreading this. Yes money is frequently tight in britain what with the ever increasing cost of living etc.
I know $10.00 doesn't sound like much but yes it does make all the difference.
What BSS leaders must realise is that AA pilots normally fly because the game is FREE. Most of us players cannot afford the latest GFx cards, processors, games, etc and so we play AA which is free and fun. We really don't join to be roped into squads and then be asked to pay further cash etc.
With regards to TBar saying we can work it off in some other way, well yes some people in principle might be able to. How about picken though? - He has a family, works every hour god sends, and has a baby that probably keeps him awake all night too. Some how I doubt that he will have many spare hours in the week and those that he does have should rightly be spent with his family.
In all honesty, I am beginning to question my future with ToW and have since yesterday contemplated removing the ToW Tag from my pilot name. Whilst this is something I don't really want to do, it is becoming a recurring thought.
BTW Picken, I totally respect the hours and manual labour you are putting in every week to keep your family. Not all men are like that - Give yourself a good pat on the back and be proud of yourself.
Tango
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For what its worth i would like to chip in a little of my thoughts.
Being member only since october i might have very little rights to give feedback but will do so anyway.
Personnally I do not see that much of a problem in contributing something that gives me pleasure (33 cts $/day) is in my opinion not much. I myself do smoke and spent about 25 cts. euro per cigaret, bad habbits do cost money but does not withhold me doing it. And lets be honest "there is no such thing as a free meal" but there are always exceptions to the rule and that should be judged case by case in private communication between ToW and the individual.
I can and will not decide for other people and shall never judge someones ability to contribute to his/hers hobby. I am sensitive for the argument that for some people 10$ is too much and for others is not a problem, so why not contribute at a level that you feel comfortable with just to emphasize you are glad with the services rendered. I myself see it as a hobby and in my book all hobbies do cost money so it sounds reasonable to me that when i am getting fun out of something that is worth something of my money. Again this is in each case different. "knowing" Tbar for short time now i have never ever had the impression that with 10$ month he is shooting to become rich out of this. So why not cut it all short and pay to your ability and just lets have some fun since that is why we all (speaking for myself) joined this game and ToW since i am having a ball.
Hopefully i have not stepped on peoples toes since never intended to but just wanted to give my opinion on this case since i have the impression (probally due to language barrier being dutch)there is a lot of flack in the direction of Tbar which he does not deserve, and he (in my opinion that is)never intended to offend or embarrase people having spoken to him several times during quite some discussions over the last couple of weeks.
Regards,
ToW_Etoile
Franklin
Being member only since october i might have very little rights to give feedback but will do so anyway.
Personnally I do not see that much of a problem in contributing something that gives me pleasure (33 cts $/day) is in my opinion not much. I myself do smoke and spent about 25 cts. euro per cigaret, bad habbits do cost money but does not withhold me doing it. And lets be honest "there is no such thing as a free meal" but there are always exceptions to the rule and that should be judged case by case in private communication between ToW and the individual.
I can and will not decide for other people and shall never judge someones ability to contribute to his/hers hobby. I am sensitive for the argument that for some people 10$ is too much and for others is not a problem, so why not contribute at a level that you feel comfortable with just to emphasize you are glad with the services rendered. I myself see it as a hobby and in my book all hobbies do cost money so it sounds reasonable to me that when i am getting fun out of something that is worth something of my money. Again this is in each case different. "knowing" Tbar for short time now i have never ever had the impression that with 10$ month he is shooting to become rich out of this. So why not cut it all short and pay to your ability and just lets have some fun since that is why we all (speaking for myself) joined this game and ToW since i am having a ball.
Hopefully i have not stepped on peoples toes since never intended to but just wanted to give my opinion on this case since i have the impression (probally due to language barrier being dutch)there is a lot of flack in the direction of Tbar which he does not deserve, and he (in my opinion that is)never intended to offend or embarrase people having spoken to him several times during quite some discussions over the last couple of weeks.
Regards,
ToW_Etoile
Franklin
Lets stop thinking and dwelling on all the negatives, so called problems, objections and take a look at the positives. As I read this thread is sounds like a bunch of unhappy campers .. which is not the case at all. What we have accomplished at this point is simply fantasitic .. and I'm proud of all of you 
This thread .. mainly is simply some peoples concerns they would be left out in the cold becuase they can't afford club dues. For some, its not a matter of what they can afford, but a principle of everything should be free in the internet. Lets not get into that .. just realize its not all free and someone has to pay for it all. As a club, the club should support itself.
There is NO WAY that I'm going to let any objection of conern interfere with the efforts I've put into the BSS. I've put my heart and soul into establishing this group with a great bunch of guys I can be proud to say are a member of our team .. the BSS. I've not invested all this time and effort to let anything stand it its way
With the above said .. I'm also the President of Tides of War and its my responsiblity to make sure this Organization perpetuates. We can't even support BSS without ToW and all its assests, contacts, facilities and services.
Tides of War .. must perpetuate.. or cease to exist in its present form. Take a good look around and you will see Tides of War is a great assest to a gamer, it is an organization one can be proud to be part of. It is also an organization that any member can rise to any position .. providing they wish to put the effort and time in too earn such position. It is an Organization that is established and respect within many different gaming circles.
The current management of Tides of War is looking at many different avenues for funding. Donations and Club Dues are the primary focus at the moment because they are also the most direct and immediate gurantee of perptuation.
At this time I want our members, the pilots... to focuse on the over all goals of the BSS and having a great time and loads of fun. What Tides wanted was the BSS to be "-THE-" flight group associated with ToW. Since there is much concerna and confusion it would be simply on me .. and ToW at this time to simple create the next Flight Battle Group for Air Attack to be that 'jewel'.. thus leaving the current BSS group as is .. and part of our associate program. In Short .. you guys really have nothing to worry about. Lets just get the BSS established and kicking ass .. When ToW starts up that 'second group', at that time any current member of the BSS that wants to be a ToW Club Member can address .. and make decision that is right for them.
In the meantime .. all "new" members .. will have the 1810 agreement presented. The only change I will make is to 'clarifiy' that the 'donation' is voluntary .. or word of honor. We do NOT monitor the donations .. we do NOT send out invoices .. we do NOT send any notice, warning, or otherwise tell a person that they are late on dues or that we have not received said donation/ dues.
Lets not dewl on something too long that really does not affect anyone untill end of March .. and won't really have any affect on the BSS at this point.
This thread .. mainly is simply some peoples concerns they would be left out in the cold becuase they can't afford club dues. For some, its not a matter of what they can afford, but a principle of everything should be free in the internet. Lets not get into that .. just realize its not all free and someone has to pay for it all. As a club, the club should support itself.
There is NO WAY that I'm going to let any objection of conern interfere with the efforts I've put into the BSS. I've put my heart and soul into establishing this group with a great bunch of guys I can be proud to say are a member of our team .. the BSS. I've not invested all this time and effort to let anything stand it its way
With the above said .. I'm also the President of Tides of War and its my responsiblity to make sure this Organization perpetuates. We can't even support BSS without ToW and all its assests, contacts, facilities and services.
Tides of War .. must perpetuate.. or cease to exist in its present form. Take a good look around and you will see Tides of War is a great assest to a gamer, it is an organization one can be proud to be part of. It is also an organization that any member can rise to any position .. providing they wish to put the effort and time in too earn such position. It is an Organization that is established and respect within many different gaming circles.
The current management of Tides of War is looking at many different avenues for funding. Donations and Club Dues are the primary focus at the moment because they are also the most direct and immediate gurantee of perptuation.
At this time I want our members, the pilots... to focuse on the over all goals of the BSS and having a great time and loads of fun. What Tides wanted was the BSS to be "-THE-" flight group associated with ToW. Since there is much concerna and confusion it would be simply on me .. and ToW at this time to simple create the next Flight Battle Group for Air Attack to be that 'jewel'.. thus leaving the current BSS group as is .. and part of our associate program. In Short .. you guys really have nothing to worry about. Lets just get the BSS established and kicking ass .. When ToW starts up that 'second group', at that time any current member of the BSS that wants to be a ToW Club Member can address .. and make decision that is right for them.
In the meantime .. all "new" members .. will have the 1810 agreement presented. The only change I will make is to 'clarifiy' that the 'donation' is voluntary .. or word of honor. We do NOT monitor the donations .. we do NOT send out invoices .. we do NOT send any notice, warning, or otherwise tell a person that they are late on dues or that we have not received said donation/ dues.
Lets not dewl on something too long that really does not affect anyone untill end of March .. and won't really have any affect on the BSS at this point.
Ok let me put one thing straight, I have directed nothing at Tbar, I'm sure in my post I actually praised him for his hard work, so lets be clear it is not a dig dirrected at anyone, I am fracking enjoying myself flying with you guys, and sure nothing in life is free trust me I know that bastard, $10 a month ok not a great figure u look at it as what 25 cents a day or something? well I am honestly that tight it would be a choice of feed my son or fly AA and there realy is no choice. People may laugh at my life they may pitty the fact I must work so hard just to keep on top of my out goings to them I say come work my life you wouldnt last a month! this isnt dirrected at anyone so please do not be offended, I dont wish to drag the subject on but feel I need to get this of my chest. We have on average 9 new people start in my department each month of them 1 will not even show, 1 will leave within the first 2 hours another wont return after the first day. 2 more will leave within a week. another 2 will leave withing the month and if we are lucky 2 will be there after 4 weeks. Now dont get me wrong people work as hard and harder than me and I in no way look down on people who dont have to. the lucky bastards, everyone in life has there problems just this one of mine is relevent. Tbar I respect all the work you and others must have put in to make ToW what it is, and even the small scale of BSS is more than I could manage. Tango mate dont think about hanging up the tag, I have had no impretion people unable to contribute will be "forced" out we are just a bunch of blokes having fun. s--- for now lets leave it at that!!!
Everything in life eventually boils down to the enevitability of one of three things.
Money
Power
Religion
just happens to be money in this case. I have complete faith in Tbar and that he will keep all BSS members in the loop. So I post nomore on this subject expect nothing but bollox p--- taking and the occasional yo from now on!
Hail BSS Lords of the skys (well atleast over bads base that last 15mins)
Everything in life eventually boils down to the enevitability of one of three things.
Money
Power
Religion
just happens to be money in this case. I have complete faith in Tbar and that he will keep all BSS members in the loop. So I post nomore on this subject expect nothing but bollox p--- taking and the occasional yo from now on!
Hail BSS Lords of the skys (well atleast over bads base that last 15mins)
Some very good thought .. words .. concerns are posted in this thread. It pleases me that BSS members are already loyal to the group and really love this squad ..enough so to post their 2 cents.
What pleases me most is they everyone is having fun .. and becoming better pilots by all the pilots sharing information and training each other .. truly the style of a 'band or brothers'
I've worked too hard to build this squad to let anything minor become a major problem.
Contribute what you can , when you can, as you can at this point. If you don't have then means.. then don't. WE don't measure a members value and worth by the amount that is contributed. Let your own conscious and values be your guide .. the is no measure on that, nor will there be.
If you did not agree to something when you joined .. your not bound. If you did agree, then keep your areement. Again, its all honor bound, and let your conscious dictate your actions.
The BSS will continue and no one will be forced out of Tides. As with any change or something new .. there are always things that need to be worked out to be fair on all without leaving anyone out in the cold. Have some faith
Tbar
What pleases me most is they everyone is having fun .. and becoming better pilots by all the pilots sharing information and training each other .. truly the style of a 'band or brothers'
I've worked too hard to build this squad to let anything minor become a major problem.
Contribute what you can , when you can, as you can at this point. If you don't have then means.. then don't. WE don't measure a members value and worth by the amount that is contributed. Let your own conscious and values be your guide .. the is no measure on that, nor will there be.
If you did not agree to something when you joined .. your not bound. If you did agree, then keep your areement. Again, its all honor bound, and let your conscious dictate your actions.
The BSS will continue and no one will be forced out of Tides. As with any change or something new .. there are always things that need to be worked out to be fair on all without leaving anyone out in the cold. Have some faith
Tbar